Public ITST mod '1.17d' pre-release test

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Public ITST mod '1.17d' pre-release test

Postby Elias » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 17:07

djarvik wrote:Guys, please provide some feedback on the Mod (if you have some). The more feedback we have the sooner we can finalize and release the version. Please do not be bias though, give us honest opinions and keep in mind we are looking or the best possible balance with style representation....Balance comes ALWAYS first. So do not suggest things like: "Rafa should have 95 on FH and 90 on BH etc".....these comments will be ignored.

Thanks!



1.17d download :



https://mega.co.nz/#!dVMWmSxS!s_qmfJQee ... ixycBFc9us


Installer :
**********



- Fresh install needed !

Exception If you installed 1.17c before, you can just install 1.17d over your 1.17 installation, and when
finished, you can (optionnal but recommended) go manually into the /Mods folder, to delete the ITST117c
folder, wich well free 400mo+ space).

- Used .ogg sound compression/decompression for the installer, allowing to save approx 100mo weight. After copying the files, the installer runs a batch dos-prompt window to launch the sound FX decompression, be sure to let this window finish the job, it will close itself when done, don't close the installer window before it's done.

- Perfected the new mod intall method, wich allows to simplify the mod installation :
No need anymore to create the ITST profile manually. It will be created automatically at first launch, there will be a default vanilla character first in the charsheet, but you should be able to load ITST mod characters right away.




Players :
*********


- 8 characters changes

Dropped : Davydenko, Llodra, Harrison, Brands, Tipsarevic, Sijsling, Przysiezny, F.Mayer
Added : Brown, zverev, Kyrgios, Bautista-Agut, thiem, Coric, Leo Mayer, Troicki



Grunts :
********


- new grunts created for : Thiem, Bautista-Agut, Gulbis, Kyrgios, L.Mayer




Anims :
******



Added / Updated
---------------

Nadal, Federer, Wawrinka, Djokovic, Murray new (Lucian), complete packs, binded to respective characters.



Updated
--------

Cilic Serve (Megyaem)
Cilic FH (Megyaem)
Tipsarevic FH (+acc) (Megyaem)
Almagro FH (Megyaem)
Roddick BH (Megyaem)
Fognini serve+FH+BH .v4 (Emmainf)
F.Mayer serve (Emmainf)
Monaco FH (Megyaem)
Nishikori FH (Emmainf)
Kohlshreiber serve (Emmainf)
Seppi serve (Emmainf)



Added
-------

Roddick serve (Megyaem)
Roddick BH slice (Megyaem)
Nadal BH (Jono4Sure)
Nadal BH slice (Megyaem)
Nadal FH + acc (Megyaem)
Sloane Stephens BH (Miharu)
Belinda Bencic FH (Miharu)
Bautista Agut FH (Emmainf)
Dimitrov serve, BH, slice (Emmainf)
Lopez Pack (Megyaem)
Monfils Pack (Megyaem)
Hewitt serve (Emmainf)
Monaco BH, slice (Megyaem)
Nishikori serve, BH (Emmainf)
Leo Mayer serve+FH+BH (Megyaem)
Kyrgios serve, FH (Emmainf)
Youzhny BH (Panchulo!)




Surfaces :
**********


Friction (higher is faster after bounce) / Bounce (higher.. bounces higher)
1.16 values => 1.17 values

Plexicushion 0.58 / 0.835 => 0.58 / 0.83
Cement 0.585 / 0.82 => 0.585 / 0.82
Blue-Green 0.59 / 0.83 => 0.59 / 0.815
Indoor 0.60 / 0.80 => 0.61 / 0.79
Clay 0.565 / 0.86 => 0.57 / 0.85 (0.53 slipperiness)
Madrid Clay 0.57 / 0.85 => 0.575 / 0.845 (0.53 slipperiness)
Grass 0.58 / 0.77 => 0.59 / 0.77
Wimbly Grass 0.59 / 0.79 => 0.60 / 0.78

Global tweeks :

- Global speedconversion to 0.43 (vs 0.50 default)
- All surfaces but clay's got 0.62 slipperiness (Hideceleration) vs 0.65 default.


We didn't had much Cement tournaments, but as most had surface have been fastened, i switched Indian Wells to Cement (like Miami), and Acapulco also switched to Cement (good opportunity to prepare for IW), Cement is
slightly slower compared to Blue Green Decoturf surface.



Courts
******


Several new 2D courts replaced. i'll probably post a complete list of it later on at final release time.

Also replaced the 9 vanilla courts.
I wanted to get the UI more consistent / homogeneous and created 9 more icons for them. We have 8 surfaces @ ITST, so instead of keeping vanilla ones, i replaced this courts with ITST surfaces physics, labelling them by surface name. except one court : Vanilla carpet, wich stays there, as is. I used the best 2D courts (subjective choice) among our collection for this default courts. Can be handy for newcomers if they don't know what too chose or just want to go for a specific surface.



The Main course : Balance.
*******************************



Some simple observations from 2014 season :

- Fast characters are preferred, if we could have the stat from all draws, i bet that the average match-up speed would
be around 70. (both chars speed / 2).
- 2 handers favored vs 1 handers. (Gasquet being the exception, Federer will always be picked for his fame regardless his stats).
- High counter characters favored
(exception being Nadal & Ferrer, despite speed and counter, and despite being better than before, still not up to par, but closer).

- very low rate of selection for heavy characters. We could also observe specific match-ups opposing top players/movers,
that the imbalance, if not always blatant, was very perceptible, or sometimes a no-match even if some resistance was possible (Richie Berdych vs Pidzi Simon was a good example of "i couldn't do anything").


Intent :
---------



Instead of twisting too much the gameplay / surfaces into something wich may look ugly, working on balance with some positive trend attitude, meaning not relying too much on gimps, more about "let's them be all op", or much closer, with different approaches, dropping some concepts and reviewing a bit different schemes (power/spin relation, 1h vs 2h balance) and of course, taking more risks balancing the Heavies -and- the Volleyers (which are not much used either).

If we get more variety in match-ups, that means less monotony, an globally a lower average rally length. And if we're going a bit wrong with the balance, toward another character category, good times, it' ll bring some fresh air to the field for 2015.

- Heavies : Each of these categories, are faster, and have more power.

- Volleyers : Experience shows that, depsite very good net skills/presence, you still have to be able to reach the net to get the goods, and like in real tennis most of the game relies heavily on baseline potential. They are not bad in 1.16 but their baseline abilities, speed/wings/precision gimps, low counter, overall are too much of a gimp to make them viable for the average player :

* All these Varied's switched to Volleyer style, keeping the pretty high net presence stats (max 86).
* Brown, Mahut, Lopez, Stepanek are 85+ net presence volleyers, 69/65 speed/tonicity, and strong serves (78/80'ish).
* Stakhovsky, Kubot, are 70/65 speed volleyers, ~75-78 net presence, standard/good powered serves (74/75).

All these volleyers wings, have a 'standard' power/spin scheme (meaning no power bonus regarding their slightly lower speed,they get the wing power a 71 speed char would get. Their consistency scheme is 83/78 instead of a standard 85/78, and the precisions scheme is +3/0 instead of the regular +6/0 and it's variants.

- the Heavy servers, Raonic & Isner, have their game backed by a better netplay, being switched to Varied style, keeping a good net precence (75-80). Like other heavies they are faster than before, but still the slower among the roster (-1 speed to Delpo/Berd). Serve consistency gap to power also slightly lowered.


1 hand vs 2 hands :
**********************


Power gimp lowered(2% average). It's intended to be balanced at equal power by Manutoo, i doubt it is (we can
easily see that most of top 10 MG guys are using one handers), though the 4% power average gap i used was probably
to deep as well. Cutting the fruit in half, and we'll see what happens. Sure 1H backhands produce faster shots, but
they also generates more ue's. Overall, more 1 handers picks also means more ball speed around, more winners, but
also more faults, wich favours the same objectives as changes detailed above.


Power/Spin, ball speed
**************************


Here again, since start i think i'm not wrong about it, and there is no straight rule about it, but it's not
a linear calculation and also depends on other factors (speed, counter, low or high spin being treated differently).
Still, overall, i lowered the previous gaps established. Especially if there is a speed difference between two characters.

Meaning before i always treated a 70 speed char almost like a 71 one. Now, a 70 or 70.5 speed character, will usually compensate with a sight power bonus relatively to the spin value.

Overall, all high spinners got a 1% power increase on wings.


Speed categories
******************


-Nadal & Ferrer stays alone @ 72/65

-The previous 72's are 71.5/75 (Kori, sImon, Dolgo, Monfils, tursunov etc),

- Hewitt ageing is back to 71, with lower serve power and net presence stat (66), still probably a very solid baseliner.

- Like i wrote above, i tried to be a bit more generous on power for 70's vs 71's, especially if they don't have high counter
or much other assets in their game. but that means 0.5/1% power. nothing huge. Also created a 70.5 speed category.

- 69/65 category, they didn't changed a lot, except an improved FH power (like standard -0.5 or -1 power still),keeping a precision gimp over FH if they have a very good/exceptionnal BH, but they may be a very strong category. Gasquet is the one who hasn't almost being modified at all. Federer should be back at a much more competitive level with a very good FH, a nocticeably more reliable BH, +2 serve power, but lowered counter (83).

Note : overall, precision gimps don't go below -2 now.

- Wawrinka/Gulbis are 68/66, instead of 68/65 before (well, Gulbis moved in a faster category here), wich bring them closer to Gasquet/Fed/Haas in term of movement. (same Run Acceleration).

- Zverev/Pospisil : i inserted a 67/67 speed category there, as alternatives, more powerful than the 68/69's, and a bit less than the 66's. Let's see this as a test, if 66's are not yet properly balanced, maybe the 67's will do better.

- 66/66 : Tsonga, Jano, Rosol, Kyrgios, Cilic etc (in between 86.5 and 88 power FH depending the spin).

- 64/64 Delpo; Berdych, 90/85 , 89/85 powered wings, power baseliners with decent counter for their size.(74-78).

-63/63 : Raonic, Isner. Huge serves, Varied with a good net jump, 88/83 power, standard consistencies, +4/0 precision scheme, 'low' counter (~70).


Hosting options
******************


Control scheme is unlocked in the newtork hosting options, to allow for testing Elite Controls mode, wich could be interesting to test out. If you test Elite, though, be sure you and your oppnent to switch your characters Auto-Positionning to average in your character sheet. We already tested Elite along with slow autopos and it was not convincing at all.

The CRC# checks ar up to date with the last stats, so they are working in this test version with current stats.

Not that if you test Elite mode along with average Auto-pos, the Auto-Pos change will change the CRC# and renders it invalid, wich is expected.

As it is a test version, of course all character sheet sliders and anim selection are unlocked and available.
No new outifts for this version, i'll update them for final release.


Note : the Google spreadsheet is not updated yet.

Have fun and report !
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby Elias » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 19:00

By the way i forgot to edit the hosting tagline, wich is still "1.17b", wich is not a problem anyway. So 1.17c is 1.17beta that's it.. :P
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby FEDERER2 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 20:53

is there a way to fix the sound without reinstalling because i cant hear any sound
Biggest wins: Singles:DC:def. mohd954 (10) 7-6(4) 7-6(9), RG:def.pigrosofo (15) 4-6 6-4 6-3 7-6(7)
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby Elias » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 21:21

Just let the sound decompression execute fully and don't close the black prompt window before it ends and close by itself.
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby FEDERER2 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 22:21

ok it worked thx
Biggest wins: Singles:DC:def. mohd954 (10) 7-6(4) 7-6(9), RG:def.pigrosofo (15) 4-6 6-4 6-3 7-6(7)
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby marko279 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 23:19

Wow... just tested it. I dont know if its placebo, but its like a new game.
Thx for adding borna coric and fixing marin cilic. On cilic, whoever did his motion, he got it. I know, trained with marin a long time ago. So thumbs up. Amazing motion, serve, backhand and forehand. Just wondering, any chance to put in ivo karlovic? The highest player on tour? I know there are 3 croats already :)
I like this new update. Hope everyone will play with it. How that works? Will everyone play on this and 1.16 goes to past, or what? There are not very much itst players, so dividing them into two versions...i am afraid i ll never find oponnent. Dont play tour just one two matches per day online.
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby Rafa15 » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 15:37

a few questions: 1. when will you release the full new 1.17 mod?
2. is it possible to play with the new ITST chracter rooster in SAM patch? maybe replacing the old files`?
3. the new anims are not in this demo or?
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby djarvik » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 16:39

Rafa15 wrote:a few questions: 1. when will you release the full new 1.17 mod?
2. is it possible to play with the new ITST chracter rooster in SAM patch? maybe replacing the old files`?
3. the new anims are not in this demo or?


1. As soon as we go through this Beta Phase (few weeks at most).
2. We do not support Sam's patch.
3. WE have used many new animations, but not all. We tend to use a higher quality ones.
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby djarvik » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 16:42

marko279 wrote:Wow... just tested it. I dont know if its placebo, but its like a new game.
Thx for adding borna coric and fixing marin cilic. On cilic, whoever did his motion, he got it. I know, trained with marin a long time ago. So thumbs up. Amazing motion, serve, backhand and forehand. Just wondering, any chance to put in ivo karlovic? The highest player on tour? I know there are 3 croats already :)
I like this new update. Hope everyone will play with it. How that works? Will everyone play on this and 1.16 goes to past, or what? There are not very much itst players, so dividing them into two versions...i am afraid i ll never find oponnent. Dont play tour just one two matches per day online.


Ivo Karlovic - many reason why not to include him....you listed one of them ;)

This is a Test Version, it meant to be out to collect some feedback for us to finalize the version. Once it released in its Final - all tournaments will be played with 1.17
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby KENZ » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 18:09

Good job. It's a great update but i'm a bit disappointed to do not see Steve Johnson and Guillermo Garcia-Lopez. I can't wait the final version. :P
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby djarvik » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:32

Guys, please provide some feedback on the Mod (if you have some). The more feedback we have the sooner we can finalize and release the version. Please do not be bias though, give us honest opinions and keep in mind we are looking or the best possible balance with style representation....Balance comes ALWAYS first. So do not suggest things like: "Rafa should have 95 on FH and 90 on BH etc".....these comments will be ignored.

Thanks!
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby Elias » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 20:36

Yes, keep in mind that the final 1.17 will probably run the tour for several months if not a year. So we need to get things right as much as possible.

No need to write extra-long reports. But when you test characters with a partner, please mirror the match-up and play another set if you feel one of the character could be too good. Mirrorring is always more informative.
I'm thinking to Isaldor(djokovic) vs Richie(Berdych) , losing 3-6, thats a non-information for me, or at least nothing shocking. Please mirror it and check if there Richie has a hell of a hard time to win, or even loses it. That would be informative (in a bad way, meaning we could have to adjust Berd), etc.

Most important balance areas are heavy characters vs fast characters (70+). Being Tsonga category, or Berd category.
And also volleyers vs fast/standard characters.

And in my opinion it's not a problem if the heavy guys are on the edge of balance having some slight advantage. They must be frightening the opponent, and it should take some good defenders to contain them on the court. That's also part of the dynamics changes we'd like to observe on ITST tour. Even though of course we don't want them to be overtly overpowered.

My personal 'general' observations for now :

in 1.17c i lowered slightly volleyers stats compared to the closed 1.17b test, vs. Tomi(Federer), me playing with Brown, then with Nishikori, i lost two times, 2-6 2-6 with Brown, 6-7 2-6 with Kori, i could resist much more with Nishikori, especially the first set was pretty balanced, with Brown it felt more like a no match, and i didn't had much occasions to benefit of my net skills, barely approaching the net. It was on Blue green though wich i think bounce has been tweaked too low (wich doesnt means the results are invalid but promotes counter, in addition to be some unpleasant one-dimensional fast and boring pong to me.). My take is that volleyers didn't needed to be weakened (from 1.17b to 1.17c, max net presence were reduced from 90 to 85, counter lowered as well from 79/80 to 75/74, and precision scheme from +4/0 to +3/0. I think we could go back to something closer to what it was in the previous close test. Also Federer is extremely good as it is right now (he's not alone though), but that's another point (changes from 1.17b from 1.17c about Federer has been +2 power on serve, and BH consistency from 76 to standard 78), his BH consistency could probably stay at 76 in my opinion, his power being decent there and the FH being golden. Depends on testing vs some other 'high profile' characters.

About the surfaces, especially Blue green i got some reports from Vmoe, and the same feeling from Don, and i feel about the same about it. Like i wrote just above, slight arcadey boring feeling. It plays like 1.16 indoors. Overall i think i really prefer promoting a bit less friction, than a lower bounce, so i think that in the final version BG will stay at least at 82 bounce (it was 83 in 1.16), like Cement, along with less friction than Cement. Faster surfaces overal gameplay feeling should be reviewed as well, then probably the changes could be tempered down a bit, espcially as we have more power around already.

Fot this reason, if you run balance tests, for now, do it on IW or Miami Cement courts, Clay or Plexi. Though it's always interesting to check if volleyers behave better on faster surfaces.
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby Sabratha » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 23:40

I like it, the 71.5 speed will take a bit of getting used to though.
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby kenriskey777 » Tue, 17 Feb 2015 02:16

Hi Guys ! Will the final version be able to play on Mac/Osx ? I'm very excited :D I used to have some problems with the mod 1.16 (like all the players have the same hairstyle, dreadlocks...) I hope that wont happen again with 1.17 version. Really appreciate for all the hard works,guys !!
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Re: Public ITST mod '1.17c' pre-release test

Postby djarvik » Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:39

Guys, remember, lack of feedback means agreement with current state of the mod, which means no changes will take place. :wink:


So if you not posting constructive criticisms - means all is well and we are ready to release the mod as it is....and it will stay the Official Tour mod for a long time.

I really urge you to post all your impressions and feedback, however silly it may sound to you. :P
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